JCDC x FM x E1: Les Contemporains. Chapter 3: PAM Boy. The third part of the exclusive series captured by Fabien Montique with Jean-Charles de Castelbajac, for Entitled1.

Jean-Charles de Castelbajac has spent over 40 years curating Les Contemporains – a gallery of artists who inspire him and shape the spirit of their time – which counts the likes of Andy Warhol and Vivienne Westwood among its subjects.

In its latest instalment, photographer Fabien Montique captures creatives who define the present moment at his home studio in Paris, where each embodies an iconic piece from Jean-Charles’s archive.

In this chapter, PAM Boy visits Fabien and Jean-Charles on his way to Gare du Nord to catch a train for London Fashion Week.

Transcript: 

K: What colour describes how you feel today?

PAM: I would say a bright pink. I’m in a good mood, and pink is a joyous colour. So probably pink, a bright, shocking pink.

K: Love that, fuchsia, in your face.

PAM: Yes, something that pops, something that says, “I’m happy, or I’m as happy as I can be.”

K: That’s what we want to hear! Tell me a bit about how you know Jean Charles.

PAM: I’ve always seen Jean Charles as an icon of French fashion. I’ve always appreciated his work because he’s true to himself. When you look at fashion today, everything seems quite homogeneous, but when you look at Jean Charles’s pieces, they stand out, and you can recognize them, whether you know about fashion or not. He has also crossed over into pop culture, so people do know his name and are able to spot his flair and his style out of a million pieces out there. That’s why I feel like he’s someone that matters. His work matters.

K: What a brilliant description of Jean-Charles’s work and his universe. Now, could you tell me about Fabien and how you’ve come to work with him?

PAM: I actually don’t remember when we met, but I have been familiar with his work. Fabien, to me, has always been that type of photographer who can capture beauty in a simple yet complex way.

Then we got to work together at GQ, and it was fantastic. I love his calm demeanour and that he always knows what he wants. He’s not a diva at all, or maybe just a little bit, like every creative person. We understand each other not just on a creative level, but also on a personal level.

I also appreciate how sincere he is. There’s no fakeness in his work and in himself as a person.

We’ve stayed in touch and always text and have a lot of fun. To me, that’s how to cherish a relationship that started off professionally and ended up as a great connection. Sometimes it can seem like just an offhand thing, but actually keeping that connection going through shared laughter and shared fun moments is so important. I love that light-heartedness that Fabien has, and I appreciate it.

K: Yeah, me too. Speaking of photography and moments captured on the phone, can you describe the last photo you took with your phone?

PAM: I love documenting people in the street. Whenever there’s someone wearing something interesting, or completely mundane, but they wear it with style. I love looking at people in the Parisian metro. Or it would have to be a picture of my baby nephew, who’s two and a half months old. Those are my two obsessions at the moment to photograph.

K: It’s funny you say that, because one of the next questions is, “What are you obsessed with right now?”

PAM: There you go. I’m obsessed with my baby nephew.

What else am I obsessed with? I’m obsessed with cooking. I love cooking. I love learning new recipes. It’s the only moment when I don’t think about fashion, when I’m in the kitchen, which is great, because the rest of the time I’m like fashion, fashion, fashion.

K: And in the kitchen you’re like, chop, chop, chop.

PAM: Oh yeah, in the kitchen it’s focus, follow the recipe.

K: That’s really interesting, what you say about cooking and how that can be such a switch off for the brain. It makes me think of another question, which is, what are three words that would describe your taste?

PAM: Three words. I’m sorry, I’m not giving you three words, more like three ideas.

I’ve built a sense of taste by, one, remaining curious. I always want to know what’s out there. Then I would also say that I love the idea of thinking against myself. It’s not because I like something that I shouldn’t question the reasons why I like it. And then the third idea would be curiosity, open-mindedness. I do like clothes that are classic, but with a twist.

So my taste is informed by all of that. My curiosity, my ability to think against myself, and the idea that we can twist classics and have fun with them.

K: Thank you for expanding on the three words, that’s such an interesting combination of things. It brings something really rich and varied.

PAM: I think taste is really about capturing everything that’s around you. Because ultimately, I don’t even believe in good or bad taste. I think there’s just taste. What matters, ultimately, is that you have a point of view. When you have taste, no matter what the taste is, you have a point of view. So I’m trying to have a point of view myself.

K: Speaking of point of view, when you are creating, or when you’re working, how do you know when your idea is good?

PAM: I never know when my ideas are good. But I have ADHD, so I have the tendency to come up with new ideas very quickly. But then I have this visceral feeling. There’s something you can’t even explain. It’s almost like an emotional reaction to an idea, which happens to me often. Then I try it out and see if it works.

And I really, really believe that if you do something that you are truly excited about, people will see it and people will understand it. It doesn’t have to be perfect. But that honesty and authenticity will almost always be beneficial to you on a professional and personal level. Maybe I’m naive, but I really believe that.

K: I, too, want to believe that. Speaking about authenticity, this brings me on to a question about almost the opposite of it. What’s the most boring question that you often get asked?

PAM: One of the most boring questions to me is, “What does PAM Boy stand for?” PAM are simply my initials. To me it’s so obvious. But many people thought, before I had shown my face online, that it stood for Pamela or something. I remember receiving an invitation for Fashion Week, and they said, “Mrs PAM Boy.” It made me laugh.

K: What’s a question you wish you were asked more often?

PAM: The question that I wish I was asked more often is, “How are you?”, but in a way that someone is actually trying to connect with you, not the way that sounds like email courtesy.

K: It’s so weird how that’s become such a superficial phrase. I often put it in my emails and then think, should I? But I actually do wish people well.

PAM: I do it too. But I always try to remind myself to ask people how they are and allow them to go beyond “I’m good” or “I’m fine”.

Actually, I have another one of the most boring questions that you can ask someone.

K: Go for it.

PAM: The question is, “What do you do?” I feel like in the creative field, we do so many different things. And in our society, our identity is so tied to our job.

I would rather ask someone, “What are you passionate about?” or “What have you done lately that made you happy?” It’s a more human way of interacting, in my opinion. I wish people would ask me that more often as well.

K: I couldn’t agree with you more. The hallmark of a good conversation for me is if, by the end, I don’t know what that person does for a living.

PAM: As a matter of fact, I was here a few months ago. Fabien had a little get-together. I spoke to so many people that I didn’t know, and I don’t remember at any point being asked, or asking someone, “What’s your job?” Networking is important, but it’s nice when there’s more depth.

K: Completely. Now, on to a different strand of questions. What song have you recently added to your playlist?

PAM: I’m a big Shazam fan. Every time I’m out, I Shazam sounds and music that I don’t know. So I couldn’t tell you exactly which one I’ve added to my playlist, because they all go to my liked songs. And I’ve been listening to Vivaldi a lot, just because classical music calms me down.

K: Great. A couple more to wrap us up. When you think about things that were designed and created this century, is there one that you think will keep being relevant and stand the test of time?

PAM: Does it have to be a piece of art?

K: Anything.

PAM: I’m a firm believer that print is going to stay. We are in the digital era, everything is virtual, we enjoy it, and it’s a great way to communicate and spread our work.

But I do believe that print, whether it’s books or magazines, will stand the test of time. We will need tangible objects to use as time capsules. I do believe that print, as a concept or as a tool, will never go away, no matter how we try to replace it.

K: You said time capsules. If you could put any one object in a time capsule to yourself to open in 2076, in 50 years’ time, what would it be?

PAM: Wow. I would love to see something analog. So it would be one of my favourite books, or a CD player with headphones and Beyoncé’s first album, Dangerously in Love.

K: Such a great album. What a cover as well!

PAM: I know! With the full CD, not just the actual CD, but the full album with the leaflet and the pictures, everything.

K: I remember that leaflet and hanging out in my cousin’s bedroom in the 2000s and listening to the album all the way through. And what book would it be?

PAM: It could either be an encyclopaedia, because I collected them. My parents used to buy them for me and my siblings, and I’ve always been super curious. With ADHD, I want to know everything, and I can wake up at 3am and decide that I need to learn more about volcanoes.

Or it would have to be The Secret History by Donna Tartt, which is just a fantastic book. It’s a very tedious read, because there’s a lot of references and a lot of work that you have to do. But it’s a beautiful book and a crazy story.

K: Sounds great. I’m going to have to Google it after this.

PAM: It’s really, really good. It’s intense. And Donna Tartt writes a book once every ten years.

K: It’s like a rare, precious gift every decade.

PAM: Yeah. It’s like, boom, here’s a book. See you in 10 years!

K: Last question for you. Do you trust your instinct more or less today than when you were just starting out?

PAM: I would be a liar if I said I trust my instinct more. I think the more I grow as a person, the more I tend to question myself and my instinct. Some people might say that with more experience, you tend to follow your gut a bit more. In my case, with more experience, I tend to question my instinct a lot more because I want to understand where those instincts come from.

I think it’s one thing to have a gut feeling. It’s another thing to analyse that gut feeling and try to extract some sort of logic or emotional trigger.

K: Completely. Thank you. That was such an interesting conversation. I wish we could keep talking, but I have to let you go. You have a Eurostar to catch!